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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
G'day

Thought i would share my experience in getting my factory ECU fully dyno tuned. Ive also noticed a few questions on it so i hope this helps.


I had a full dyno tune done to the stock ECU. No aftermarket tuners or PC5 etc.

Half the reason for the tune was to set it up for the modifications I made.

The other half was to make the bike perform and ride differently. I wasn't trying to break any HP records..

So my Mods: Decatted Header pipes, Yoshi slip-on(no baffle) Iridium Spark Plugs, K&N air filter and snorkel delete on the airbox.
Pretty simple and cheap mods..

Bike went into shop and made 30HP (at the wheels)
After Setup and tune the Bike made 34HP! That’s over a 10% increase in power!

In Kawasaki terms(Kawasaki rate at the flywheel), I made 38.5hp!
Dyno tests on stock ninja’s barely make 35hp..


I will try and keep what and why we did what we did brief. Feel free to ask anything if you want more details

I have had a lot of the engine braking reduced. So now my bike doesn’t lurch and try and buck me off when you close off the throttle. It still has engine braking but the revs when 0% throttle start to drop off slowly (instead of violently) with no sudden slow down.
This is very handy in car parks or when trying to cruise at speed limit, especially down hill. I found it hard to keep throttle open enough to cruise without accelerating but was so close to 0% throttle that a small bump would close throttle and engine braking kicked in..
EG: its now like backing off the accelerator in an Automatic car vs a manual car


We have gained more control of the 2nd throttle body. Which allows it to open up more than it used to. More air and fuel into the motor makes for more power / acceleration.
So before when I twist my wrist to wide open throttle, only one throttle body was fully open, the other was still half closed. (2nd throttle body controlled by ECU) We think the main reason for this was the LAMS status of the bike.
Timing and ignition has been adjusted to above changes.
This has giving me more acceleration and a smoother application of that power.
No flat spots and it doesn’t run Rich or Lean like it does from factory.
I now also have a Redline of 13,500 rpm. Not 13,000 rpm from factory

I am very impressed with how the bike performs now!
 

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Note: "So my Mods: Decatted Header pipes, Yoshi slip-on(no baffle) Iridium Spark Plugs, K&N air filter and snorkel delete on the airbox.
Pretty simple and cheap mods..

Bike went into shop and made 30HP (at the wheels)
After Setup and tune the Bike made 34HP! That’s over a 10% increase in power!"


Does this mean, that with all your mods your Ninja has lost at least between 2.5 to 3.8 hp and with the ECU-Tune you just got them back?
 

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Different conditions will yield different results i.e humidity, temp etc. Each dyno will also give different results, you can dyno the bike at one place and get 34hp and dyno the exact same bike somewhere else and get 38hp so it doesn't mean that his bike has "lost" anything.
What is important in this is the improvement in hp, power delivery and ride-ability. It definitely sounds like a great way to improve the bike. I know I'ld definitely be getting the ecu flashed and tuned if the racing rules here weren't so restricting
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Note: "So my Mods: Decatted Header pipes, Yoshi slip-on(no baffle) Iridium Spark Plugs, K&N air filter and snorkel delete on the airbox.
Pretty simple and cheap mods..

Bike went into shop and made 30HP (at the wheels)
After Setup and tune the Bike made 34HP! That’s over a 10% increase in power!"


Does this mean, that with all your mods your Ninja has lost at least between 2.5 to 3.8 hp and with the ECU-Tune you just got them back?
No. this is at the wheel horsepower. kawasaki rate at the flywheel.
I probably lost 0.5 - 1hp ish with the mods at the flywheel. but made up 4 with a tune. so netted 3-3.5hp gain.


And yes this is on this dyno getting a reading of 34hp(at the wheels)
his race bikes make 37hp but have made 41 on other dyno's..
he calls his dyno 'the heartbreaker' ..


but like i said it wasn't all about power. it was about making the bike more enjoyable to ride and tuning to suit the mods.
 

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his race bikes make 37hp but have made 41 on other dyno's..
Thanks for your answer.
The sentence above makes it clear for me, since everywhere the dynos show between 32.3 and 33.1 hp at the wheel (one showed even 33.8 hp at the wheel).
And I also know very well that each dyno can be setup very individual so they show what the operator wants.

So enjoy your Ninja and have fun.
 

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I'm pretty well aware that most dynos read 15% over reality. Dynojet along with tuners started this mess because higher numbers means happy customers. The thing is, this kind of reading has become standard. It's what you see in magazine dyno run results.

The problem is that the 1% of dyno tuners that buck the trend and make their dynos read real hp are really making their tuning results incomparable with everyone else's. IMHO, this is not a good thing. Every dyno run this guy makes pisses off his customers and has to come with a big asterisk on it.

Some might say that every dyno is different. That's not necessarily true. Most dyno operators, especially the common Dynojet 250I, run the same setup as other operators, which produces results that are comparable. This, IMHO, is more important than knowing real hp.
 

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Just run a base line and then run the new tune. That way you know what the gain is.

I had no idea you can dyno a stock ecu.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Just run a base line and then run the new tune. That way you know what the gain is.
yeah I did. gained 4hp at the wheels. pic in OP

I had no idea you can dyno a stock ecu.
neither did I!
I questioned my tuner as well. um wont i need a pc5 or something?
he is said no. can only tune fuel and timing with that
I can change much more on the stock ecu.

and he has! as stated changed throttle body control etc. cant do that with a pc5..
 

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Nice. Guys that can tune an ECU without a power commander are rare. None of my local tuners have a clue how to do it so they say "sorry, we only tune power commanders." It's pretty annoying since power commanders are totally outdated technology. Most modern ECU's can be directly written to.

The only reason I have one on the 300 is that it doesn't have an option for a 2nd map. My old GSXR 1000 had 3 maps, one for 94 octane, one for 87 octane and another partial power rain mode.
 

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I got some early numbers on my mods:

cams
head port
full yoshi
k&n
rapid bike

41hp to the wheel

full yoshi, k&n, pcv was 36 to the wheel.

your tune seems to be a good bang for the buck. i'll have write up on my modes plus cost if i can find the receipt. I think i've don't some pretty significant engine work to the bike yet spacepod has a 41hp dyno with only flash, filter, and full yoshi.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
I got some early numbers on my mods:

cams
head port
full yoshi
k&n
rapid bike

41hp to the wheel

full yoshi, k&n, pcv was 36 to the wheel.

your tune seems to be a good bang for the buck. i'll have write up on my modes plus cost if i can find the receipt. I think i've don't some pretty significant engine work to the bike yet spacepod has a 41hp dyno with only flash, filter, and full yoshi.

very nice! was thinking cams as my next mod. but then again what i have done was a fairly cheap way to gain a bit power. cams would go against that line of thinking..

wonder how happy spacepods dyno is?.. is that at wheels or flywheel?(spacepod)
 

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@Zaph, you're absolute right with what you said and one reason is that all this makes it much easier to sell their Power Commanders...
@Supersport, congratulations you should be happy with the power of your Ninja.
This is the highest rwhp I've seen up to now on the net.
Spears Enterprises give 39.86 rwhp for their race bike and the Scuderia Platini in Italy (the most experienced tuner for the little Ninjas) gives 40.53 rwhp for their race bike.

What @79MKB did was a very good way to go and if one uses his bike as street-bike only there is not many more to do.
But for racers this could not be enough, since the condition's changing from circuit to circuit, so in this case one would need a piggy-back also to setup the fuel for the different conditions.
To change the fuel with the pcv i.e. is much easier than always take the ecu out of the bike, connect it to the pc and make the changes.
Not to forget that most ecu's allow only max 10 changes and then they're locked (I don't know how much it is with our Ninjas).
But with saying all this, please never forget that a real and true measurement is only made on an engine test-bench, everything else is more like a guess.
 

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I've never heard of an ECU being locked after after any number of changes. The only exception is the 3rd gen 13+ 675, it's completely locked. 1 single change and it turns into a brick.

For comparison, I'm getting 40 rwhp with only a power commander and Yoshi full exhaust. Stock airbox and filter. 42 rwhp with race gas. Done on a 250i dyno with 40 psi in the rear tire. Better dyno operators will standardized rear tire pressure. Makes a surprising difference if it's low.

For the 3 or 4 people I've seen so far posting results for cams/port/polish, those mods don't seem to net much hp increase.
 

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Very cool! If you don't mind me asking, what did the tune cost you? (Forgive me if I missed it, I re-read the thread to double-check and didn't see it).
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I paid 450 AUD

the changes to how the bike rides and performs was worth it alone.

my mate who i ride with a fair bit, also has a ninja 300. so we swapped bikes yesterday and he was also impressed with the way it rides.
 

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Nice, sounds like serious bang for your buck!
 

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Hi

I'm interested in getting my Ninja 300 setup the same, just out of interest who did the tuning for you and what did this cost?
 

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Nice. Guys that can tune an ECU without a power commander are rare. None of my local tuners have a clue how to do it so they say "sorry, we only tune power commanders." It's pretty annoying since power commanders are totally outdated technology. Most modern ECU's can be directly written to....
Yes, but we do exist. (Disclaimer, for off road use only) -- I've got the equipment and the software to do it on all Ninja 300 ECU's, and it's pretty consistent between bikes. You can even mail to me, I can flash the ECU, send back... and it will be an improvement in so many areas. If you're very detailed on having everything a perfect, for example 13.0 on one part of the map, and 13.4 on another part of the map, and have a PCV with auto tune, it can actually aid in tuning and flashing the ECU. Install the flashed ECU with zero out the fuel maps and go from there, or dyno tune any weird stuff your exhaust may be causing, and I can re-flash with the tweaks you've made. $200 plus shipping, and I can make changes and updates as much as you want. My current tune is dialed in for 91 octane and the full Yosh R77 with dB killer installed, but it will work well with most exhaust systems.

Handy if you live close by, but not so much if you have to send it in the mail I guess.

Dave
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Hi

I'm interested in getting my Ninja 300 setup the same, just out of interest who did the tuning for you and what did this cost?

A guy on the Gold Coast in Australia. The bike went onto a dyno and was tuned to perfection using Woolich Racing software. none of this 'send it away for flash it should be ok'... and most of the time they are, but not perfect. Cost was $450 australian dollarydoos
 

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So far my mods include

PCV
BMC air filter
Block off plate
Snorkel delete (really helped with decel pop)
Stainless steel unrestricted/de-catted pipes
HBR SS gpr growler slip on no baffle
Bridgestone Battlax S20 EVOs
Galfer SS front and rear brake lines
DID Xlink chain JT front and rear sprockets
Gilles Tooling FXR rearsetsS
AS3 Performance Featherlight throttle cables
Throttle tube Renthal dual compound grips
HBR complete race bodywork kit
EvoTech rear passenger pegs delete kit
SS racing brake fluid reservoir, frame and swing arm plugs, steering yoke nut, front sprocket cover.
PSR cncd clutch adjuster
Shogun no cut frame saver kit
2x Vision X Solstice led pod lights as my fogs
Gel electrolyte battery (shoulda done lithium and gained some needed space)
HID headlight kit (not installed yet)


What should I be focusing on next? I've heard of people doing head work or cams any advice that's not dickish is more than welcome. Thx in advance.
-Wowasaki
 
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