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Discussion Starter #1
Right now, it's still quite cool in CT, so I'm riding with very solid leather gloves. Sometimes, when I ride through risky areas (lots of intersections etc.) I would really like to cover clutch and brake. The former is no problem, but the latter is: I cannot manage to get my fingers to the lever without doing untowards things to the throttle, and even once they are there, throttle fine-control is very difficult. (When wearing lighter gloves I don't have that problem.) What is y'alls' experience with that?
 

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Some after market levers have adjustability so that the distance between the lever and throttle is shortened.
I have The2Wheels lever which was like $30
 

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msf class teaches not to cover them, plus it's very easy to ride them on accident and prematurely wear them out. I'd practice using brake and clutch quickly without covering so it becomes instinct, it's not really any quicker to cover them if you become instinctive with your controls.

if you're dead set on covering them, adjustable levers will help a lot. even if you don't end up covering them they really help by shortening the reach and making you more comfortable with them.
 

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I have tiny hands (I wear women's size small gloves). In high risk areas I cover the brake and clutch with 2 fingers. Doesn't matter whether I'm wearing my heavy cold/wet weather gloves or my summer gloves, I have no issues with fine throttle control because I have adjustable shorty levers and have them set to the closest position. With the issue you're describing, I think investing in a pair might help you tremendously.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
msf class teaches not to cover them, plus it's very easy to ride them on accident and prematurely wear them out. I'd practice using brake and clutch quickly without covering so it becomes instinct, it's not really any quicker to cover them if you become instinctive with your controls.
Let's do the math on that:

Suppose you are traveling at 35 mph = 51.3 fps. Suppose you need an extra 0.1 sec to get your fingers stretched to your clutch and brake. In that time, you travel 5.1 feet, obviously.

Assuming you brake at an average 0.8g (which is quite nice for street riding), you will come to a stop at 51.4 ft. Question: What will your terminal velocity be if your braking onset is delayed by 0.1 seconds? :shrug.001:

You will be hitting the truck that is 51.4 ft away from you at 16 fps, or 11 mph instead of 0 mph :wacko: .

I'll be granting myself the privilege to override MSF recommendations when things are zipping into my line of travel any moment.
 

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Yes I just installed shorty adjustable levers and it does help tremendously with reach and grip :) I have tiny hands as well lol
 

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Let's do the math on that:

Suppose you are traveling at 35 mph = 51.3 fps. Suppose you need an extra 0.1 sec to get your fingers stretched to your clutch and brake. In that time, you travel 5.1 feet, obviously.

Assuming you brake at an average 0.8g (which is quite nice for street riding), you will come to a stop at 51.4 ft. Question: What will your terminal velocity be if your braking onset is delayed by 0.1 seconds? :shrug.001:

You will be hitting the truck that is 51.4 ft away from you at 16 fps, or 11 mph instead of 0 mph :wacko: .

I'll be granting myself the privilege to override MSF recommendations when things are zipping into my line of travel any moment.
hey it's your ride, do what you want. I'm just telling you what they teach in MSF. and be mindful that you aren't riding them vs covering them.

and yes, shorty adjustable levers are great, I really miss having them (traded my ninja)..
 

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I'm pretty sure my MSF course taught us to cover both levers when riding.

To OP, maybe you could adjust the angle of the levers?
Really? we were specifically told not to, and told us they'd be watching for it during exercises and tests. that our hands should only be on the levers if we are using them.
 

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MSF told us NOT to cover our brake/clutch.

In the BRC2 course, they did the same thing. I didn't care. I still covered them. I feel more comfortable covering my controls when I know I'll be using them soon.

But what the BRC course teaches you doesn't always mean it's the right thing to do on the street.

Unless I'm all alone in the open road, I almost always cover. At least with 1 finger on each lever. That 0.1 second of delayed reaction may mean stopping in time vs a small accident.

Although this incident didn't require me to use my brakes...had the dog not be on the leash, it would've been nice to be able to slow down before I ran it over and endo.

 

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Discussion Starter #13
I'm pretty sure my MSF course taught us to cover both levers when riding.

To OP, maybe you could adjust the angle of the levers?
That's a good idea, too! I just came back from a ride, and if the brake is just a smidgeon lower, I don't have to lift my fingers as far to rest them on top.
 

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Really? we were specifically told not to, and told us they'd be watching for it during exercises and tests. that our hands should only be on the levers if we are using them.
From what I remember the reason I was told to cover both was that if you grab both, it will cause to you slow down/stop and disengage the engine. Both of which seem like good safe reasons and which helped me within the first half day of my training.

Story time:
When I took the MSF course, I accidentally let the clutch out while revving and the bike launched forward. In a panic, I grab both levers and the bike stops with me on the back seat. I accidentally let go of both levers with engine still revving and the bike launched forward again. In a panic, I grabbed both levers again and bike stops with me mostly off the back seat. I'm almost pulling the superman maneuver at this point. It was a 125/250 cruiser (can't remember now) so my feet were still pretty close to the ground and the bike stayed up the whole time. A friend of mine wasn't so lucky (on a dirt bike) and either didn't cover the levers or grab them in time, so his bike wheelie'd out from underneath him. He held on (due to being in a panic) and the bike landed on its side.
 

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Story time:
When I took the MSF course, I accidentally let the clutch out while revving and the bike launched forward. In a panic, I grab both levers and the bike stops with me on the back seat. I accidentally let go of both levers with engine still revving and the bike launched forward again. In a panic, I grabbed both levers again and bike stops with me mostly off the back seat. I'm almost pulling the superman maneuver at this point. It was a 125/250 cruiser (can't remember now) so my feet were still pretty close to the ground and the bike stayed up the whole time. A friend of mine wasn't so lucky (on a dirt bike) and either didn't cover the levers or grab them in time, so his bike wheelie'd out from underneath him. He held on (due to being in a panic) and the bike landed on its side.
Sounds like fun.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
When I took the MSF course, I accidentally let the clutch out while revving and the bike launched forward.
People have died in MSF courses because the bike ran away from them, they panicked and froze, and they hit a solid obstacle like a building or a pole. Apparently, this is a bigger problem with the Harley Davidson rider course because of the much bigger bikes, which go much faster by the time you are at that oak tree.
 

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Really? we were specifically told not to, and told us they'd be watching for it during exercises and tests. that our hands should only be on the levers if we are using them.
We were told to cover them in our class, too. I think it all depends on who your instructor is.
 

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From my understanding and this is just my understanding. This is what I was taught and the argument was really good. The reason you wouldn't want to cover the brake is so that there is no panic braking resulting in a highside or lowside crash (depending on the locked up wheel). If you cover the brake its fine if everything goes to plan and you don't panic. Most people would probably panic as they do in cars. So its a statics game. Odds are panic is happening. Only you know yourself so I say whatever is safest for you is the way to go. As for fixing your issues with the gloves get yourself some adjustable levers.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
From my understanding and this is just my understanding...
That certainly makes sense. In that case, I think I'm fine.

- I got ABS
- I practice panic braking several times a week from 30-40 mph (as opposed to parking lot speeds), so I know what it feels like when my neck is not on the line
- I understand the physics, and timing, of weight transfer

MSF courses are not designed for people who know physics. They just say, "Do this!" without ever justifying why. If you don't know why, you don't know when it's safe(r) to break the rule.
 
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