2017 Ninja 650 - Page 4 - Kawasaki Ninja 300 Forum
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post #31 of 40 (permalink) Old 12-17-2016, 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Elijah View Post
I'm not sure I go with "perfect" step up from the 300. The 650 is a different class of bike, it's more in the sport touring class with those high handle bars and very upright riding position.

Where the 300 makes a pretty good track bike, the 650 doesn't. It's difficult to get in to the proper body position if you want to take this bike out on track making it difficult to ride. (Though it can be done and you can have a lot of fun.) The upright body position is great and the bike is comfortable enough that you can climb on it at 7AM and ride until 9pm that night. I rode it 350 miles on Saturday then took it out and rode 950 on Sunday. I would have gone back out Monday if that pesky work thing hadn't gotten in the way. It was just that comfortable.

Coming off the 300, if you're more interested in a more upright bike for the street this is a pretty good bare bones bike. There's not a ton of mods you can do to this bike. My 650 has a single piece exhaust. So if you wanted to change it it's a full exhaust or nothing. The front suspension has absolutely no adjustments which means buying a new set of forks or slapping the ZX6R front end on it. At least on the rear you can adjust the preload on the spring.

I'd put the 650 solidly in the good first bike class. It's good on the streets. It's fun in the twisties. You can build your skills at track days. But, eventually you'll outgrow this bike's potential at the track. Once you ride something from the supersport class on track you'll wonder how you actually ever rode this thing.

So, depending on what you want to do coming off a 300 you may want to look at the 650. If you just want to cruise around on the street on a bike that looks sporty but is very comfortable, then maybe this is a good step.

If you're interested in developing your skills and maybe having some fun at the track, then I'd stay away from this bike and look to the ZX6R or another 600 class bike. If you don't think you're ready for a 600 class bike then stay on the 300, you'll learn more on it than you would on a 650. (What you'll learn coming off a 300 for the 650 is that you should have stuck with the 300.)
I'd generally agree with you on what you have said about this bike, but, the 40-something pound drop in weight should dramatically alter how the new model handles, which should be readily felt in the twisties or on the track. As far as exhaust mod's, I'm pretty sure there are a few aftermarket slip-ons one can choose from instead of a full-system. As already mentioned - throttle bodies can be swapped and I'm sure some tuning can be done. Any new bike under $10,000 will not have adjustable suspension and require similar fork swap undertakings and shock swaps, so nothing unexpected there.
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post #32 of 40 (permalink) Old 12-17-2016, 02:41 PM Thread Starter
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I'd generally agree with you on what you have said about this bike, but, the 40-something pound drop in weight should dramatically alter how the new model handles, which should be readily felt in the twisties or on the track. As far as exhaust mod's, I'm pretty sure there are a few aftermarket slip-ons one can choose from instead of a full-system. As already mentioned - throttle bodies can be swapped and I'm sure some tuning can be done. Any new bike under $10,000 will not have adjustable suspension and require similar fork swap undertakings and shock swaps, so nothing unexpected there.
I don't think slip-on is going to be an option. At least for 2012-2016 Ninja 650, it was impossible to find a slip on.
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post #33 of 40 (permalink) Old 12-17-2016, 02:46 PM Thread Starter
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Akrapovic has Titanium Full Exhaust for 2017 Ninja 650

Street: https://www.akrapovic.com/#!/motorcy...36&yearId=4425
Race: https://www.akrapovic.com/#!/motorcy...36&yearId=4425

Last edited by Timpo; 12-17-2016 at 02:48 PM.
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post #34 of 40 (permalink) Old 12-18-2016, 02:35 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Neanderthal View Post
I'd generally agree with you on what you have said about this bike, but, the 40-something pound drop in weight should dramatically alter how the new model handles, which should be readily felt in the twisties or on the track. As far as exhaust mod's, I'm pretty sure there are a few aftermarket slip-ons one can choose from instead of a full-system. As already mentioned - throttle bodies can be swapped and I'm sure some tuning can be done. Any new bike under $10,000 will not have adjustable suspension and require similar fork swap undertakings and shock swaps, so nothing unexpected there.
yeah I hope the throttle body can be swapped too.

Ducati didn't even bother to change the throttle body when they took the Scrambler 800 and made it 400.
The Scrambler 400 has the same throttle body as the 800.
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post #35 of 40 (permalink) Old 12-18-2016, 09:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Neanderthal View Post
I'd generally agree with you on what you have said about this bike, but, the 40-something pound drop in weight should dramatically alter how the new model handles, which should be readily felt in the twisties or on the track. As far as exhaust mod's, I'm pretty sure there are a few aftermarket slip-ons one can choose from instead of a full-system. As already mentioned - throttle bodies can be swapped and I'm sure some tuning can be done. Any new bike under $10,000 will not have adjustable suspension and require similar fork swap undertakings and shock swaps, so nothing unexpected there.
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I don't think slip-on is going to be an option. At least for 2012-2016 Ninja 650, it was impossible to find a slip on.
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Clearly the 2017 is like the previous 650's, it's either full exhaust of nothing.

That being said, the deal with the 650 is more about where you want to go with your riding. If you're thinking along the lines of a cruiser, but don't want the shame that goes with one, then this is the bike for you. If you're coming off the 300 and want something to further develop you're skills then stay away from the 650. If you've fully explored the potential of the 300 then there's nothing the 650 has to offer. (Trust me, I have a 650.) Chances are though you've not explored the potential of the 300.

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post #36 of 40 (permalink) Old 12-19-2016, 10:19 AM
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Clearly the 2017 is like the previous 650's, it's either full exhaust of nothing.

That being said, the deal with the 650 is more about where you want to go with your riding. If you're thinking along the lines of a cruiser, but don't want the shame that goes with one, then this is the bike for you. If you're coming off the 300 and want something to further develop you're skills then stay away from the 650. If you've fully explored the potential of the 300 then there's nothing the 650 has to offer. (Trust me, I have a 650.) Chances are though you've not explored the potential of the 300.
Currently, I have a Triumph Street Triple, a Suzuki SV650S, Ninja300 and a co-workers Ninja650 in my garage. I love my Street Triple, but it would be really nice if it had full fairings for some wind protection for touring. I have put many 500-plus mile days on the Striple, it can be done, but full fairings would have made it much nicer when it came time to bomb down an interstate.

There's a huge difference in muscling the Ninja650 around, due to the extra weight it carries over the Striple. I could see myself being happy with the 2017 version of the 650 with a few minor tweaks.

There's quite a few fellow 675-ers on this site that have the 300 in their garage - there's more to appreciate than just horsepower.
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post #37 of 40 (permalink) Old 12-19-2016, 06:22 PM Thread Starter
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Clearly the 2017 is like the previous 650's, it's either full exhaust of nothing.

That being said, the deal with the 650 is more about where you want to go with your riding. If you're thinking along the lines of a cruiser, but don't want the shame that goes with one, then this is the bike for you. If you're coming off the 300 and want something to further develop you're skills then stay away from the 650. If you've fully explored the potential of the 300 then there's nothing the 650 has to offer. (Trust me, I have a 650.) Chances are though you've not explored the potential of the 300.
Your argument is kind of pointless in real world riding.

If you want to be a Moto GP racer, sure, you should be able to ride a Ninja 300 at full potential before even thinking about moving up.

I don't know about you, but for vast majority of riders out there, there are benefit of moving up even though they have not explored the Ninja 300's full potential on the race track or something.

It's the sound, acceleration, flickability, braking capabilities, stability, etc...you can definitely feel the difference between 300 and larger displacement bikes. You don't have to be a pro rider to feel the difference between Ninja 300, 650 and ZX6R.

Some people say getting a Ferrari is pointless if you haven't pushed what Honda Civic can do at its absolute limit, but you can still feel the difference in acceleration, handling, sound, ergonomics, etc.
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post #38 of 40 (permalink) Old 12-19-2016, 08:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Timpo View Post
Your argument is kind of pointless in real world riding.

If you want to be a Moto GP racer, sure, you should be able to ride a Ninja 300 at full potential before even thinking about moving up.

I don't know about you, but for vast majority of riders out there, there are benefit of moving up even though they have not explored the Ninja 300's full potential on the race track or something.

It's the sound, acceleration, flickability, braking capabilities, stability, etc...you can definitely feel the difference between 300 and larger displacement bikes. You don't have to be a pro rider to feel the difference between Ninja 300, 650 and ZX6R.

Some people say getting a Ferrari is pointless if you haven't pushed what Honda Civic can do at its absolute limit, but you can still feel the difference in acceleration, handling, sound, ergonomics, etc.
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Originally Posted by Elijah View Post
I'm not sure I go with "perfect" step up from the 300. The 650 is a different class of bike, it's more in the sport touring class with those high handle bars and very upright riding position.

Where the 300 makes a pretty good track bike, the 650 doesn't. It's difficult to get in to the proper body position if you want to take this bike out on track making it difficult to ride. (Though it can be done and you can have a lot of fun.) The upright body position is great and the bike is comfortable enough that you can climb on it at 7AM and ride until 9pm that night. I rode it 350 miles on Saturday then took it out and rode 950 on Sunday. I would have gone back out Monday if that pesky work thing hadn't gotten in the way. It was just that comfortable.

Coming off the 300, if you're more interested in a more upright bike for the street this is a pretty good bare bones bike. There's not a ton of mods you can do to this bike. My 650 has a single piece exhaust. So if you wanted to change it it's a full exhaust or nothing. The front suspension has absolutely no adjustments which means buying a new set of forks or slapping the ZX6R front end on it. At least on the rear you can adjust the preload on the spring.

I'd put the 650 solidly in the good first bike class. It's good on the streets. It's fun in the twisties. You can build your skills at track days. But, eventually you'll outgrow this bike's potential at the track. Once you ride something from the supersport class on track you'll wonder how you actually ever rode this thing.

So, depending on what you want to do coming off a 300 you may want to look at the 650. If you just want to cruise around on the street on a bike that looks sporty but is very comfortable, then maybe this is a good step.

If you're interested in developing your skills and maybe having some fun at the track, then I'd stay away from this bike and look to the ZX6R or another 600 class bike. If you don't think you're ready for a 600 class bike then stay on the 300, you'll learn more on it than you would on a 650. (What you'll learn coming off a 300 for the 650 is that you should have stuck with the 300.)
If you go back and read my initial post you'll see we're pretty much saying the same thing. It all depends on what you want to do with the bike. It's the reason I still have one. It's also the reason I have a bike more suited for the track.

Q. Why do I ride?
A. Because I've never seen anyone jogging and smiling.


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post #39 of 40 (permalink) Old 01-17-2017, 09:33 PM
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ok I just found out that 2017 Ninja 650 will get 36mm throttle body valve instead of 38mm
Yeah, I think I saw something about slightly less peak power but slightly more mpg (maybe better mid-range due to tuning?) But then the gas tank shrinks 0.2g, iirc. Guessing that the target market is not concerned in general -- performance freaks will be looking at something else. Whoops haha, first post of this thread, this is spelled out in detail.

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... the deal with the 650 is more about where you want to go with your riding. If you're thinking along the lines of a cruiser, but don't want the shame that goes with one, then this is the bike for you.
I think you've succinctly spelled out my direction. I keep looking at cruisers, but dang it I don't want one. Not happy with Yamaha FZ6R or R3, planning to return to Kawasaki.

Do they have an expected for-sale date for USA yet? I can't find any news more recent than last November.
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post #40 of 40 (permalink) Old 01-18-2017, 11:55 AM
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I think you've succinctly spelled out my direction. I keep looking at cruisers, but dang it I don't want one. Not happy with Yamaha FZ6R or R3, planning to return to Kawasaki.

Do they have an expected for-sale date for USA yet? I can't find any news more recent than last November.
I have seen them at my local dealers already here in Long Beach. Both the 2017 Z650 and the 2017 Ninja 650.

Check out CycleTrader you should see them on there.
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